Curse

Alazardragoon · Jul 20, 2008, 12:12 AM // 00:12

I need to find a class that does not require 2 things. sunspear rep for some skills to work very good, Such as vampirism for spirit spammer Rit is a must have. And A class that don't require pvp rep based skills ether. Builds that are generally fun to play and use. That only require basic skills you can learn off tomes. Basically leaving all the rep skills out and still having a very good and effective build. I don't really have time to farm my way to max Kruzick rank. And what I have noticed is a lot of skills for Ritualists and a lot of its builds that involve spirits are focused around 2 Skills that Have a lot to do with rank and rep. Vampirism and Summon spirits. So Here's basically my question-

What class Can be leveled (Factions would be best) to level 20 And id be able to get skills and elite skills from totems mostly. Or the skill trainers. Where i would be able to get into eye of the north and be at full effectiveness with a build with those skills?

Bottom line I don't wanna spend hours and hours grinding reputation.

Is monk any good at this Just wondering cuz i do like healing in pvp.

Kumu Honua · Jul 20, 2008, 12:19 AM // 00:19

Rangers have rather nice builds with basic and elite skills.

Alazardragoon · Jul 20, 2008, 12:31 AM // 00:31

Yeah Ranger is on my consider list for sure. Any others?

dilan155 · Jul 20, 2008, 12:35 AM // 00:35

there are a huge amount if builds on pvxwiki that does not require any PvE skills, however there are also a lot of them that do require them. The only monk pve skill that is used is seed of life, this is not required and you can make a build very easily without any pve skills. other proffesions that i can think of are mesmers, rangers, assassin, paragon(motigon not imba) etc. the six core classes do have builds that dont use pve skills but some,if not most, of theses skils are unusable due to skill nerfs. for some reason a-net rarely nerf pve skills

Proff · Jul 20, 2008, 12:45 AM // 00:45

I'd suggest either an ele or a warrior, but really all classes can be used well enough without pve skills to not be a problem. So just choose whatever you like to play, if you want to monk then make one. You'll be r7-8 sunspear by the time you're done with nf anyway and seed of life, just like most pve skills, can be replaced with something else.

jiggles · Jul 20, 2008, 12:50 AM // 00:50

necromancer, necrosis isnt a req on any build.

Alazardragoon · Jul 20, 2008, 01:05 AM // 01:05

Necromancer huh, Yeah MM sounds fun. Since I do enjoy Spirit spamming with my Ritualist. Maybe Necro would be a good idea.

Vesio · Jul 20, 2008, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proff

...really all classes can be used well enough without pve skills to not be a problem. So just choose whatever you like to play, if you want to monk then make one...

amen to this! there are no classes the REQUIRE you to have any rep titles/pve skills to make good, viable builds. the only problem is that most people think you have to have them or you either a) suck or b) are stupid. so if you can handle the general majority of the GW population thinking those things about you you're home free.

glacialphoenix · Jul 20, 2008, 03:10 AM // 03:10

No class absolutely has to rely on PvE skills. If you want to make a monk, go ahead - Seed of Life isn't the necessity that so many people think it is. (Yeah, it's handy. It's not a necessity, unless you're that keen on running HB for ursans.)

Chthon · Jul 20, 2008, 03:55 AM // 03:55

I'm going to assume that when you say "work very good," you're talking about the "top-tier" builds for that class. Any class can run well enough to finish the game in NM without terribly much difficulty, even if you're not very skillful, without any PvE skills, or even good builds. If that's all you're after, you don't need to care about PvE skills at all.

Now, assuming you are after the ery top power tier, let's go through the top-tier builds and rule out the ones that require high PvE ranks:

Warrior builds with SY are on a whole other level than those without. So warrior is out of the running. As is paragon.

A ranger's best tricks (interruption, serving as a vector for buffs/trigger for hexes) don't require PvE skills, so that's an option.

PvE-only skills are rarely used on monks, with SoL as the only even marginally viable option for a general purpose monk. Monk is an option.

As for necros: MM builds profit far too much from EBSoH to leave it out. But curse builds can work with PvE skills at low rank. Moloch's AP-MoP build (definitely one of the best PvE builds in GW atm) uses 3 PvE skills, but all of them are effective with minimal rank grind.

Mesmer is a pretty weak class for PvE, saddled with a lot of mechanics that are killer in PvP, but useless in PvE. In the midst of that suckiness, AP-AE-CoP shines like the fricking sun, but CoP needs sunspear rank. So mesmer is out.

Elementalists are in a state of flux right now. They used to be regarded as "nukers," but AP-MoP and AP-AE-CoP are far more powerful in that role. For a time they were considered "utility + damage," mostly in reference to MB+RI builds, but but MB and RI got the nerfbat, and there's a problem with necromancers having comparable e-management and a better supply of utility skills in their primary skilllines. I think the future of "best" ele builds is going to revolve around what can be done with E.Renewal. That's something I consider an ongoing project which hasn't borne any fruit yet. In sum, elementalists don't have any known top-tier builds right now, so I can't say one way or the other whether you'll need PvE skills to run them.

Assassins pretty much require Critical Agility, so that's out.

Ritualists don't have any top-tier builds at all. Everything they can do can be done better with another primary. (So very sad.)

Paragons are out because imbagon needs SY and TNtF.

Dervishes are largely a purposeless mess in PvE. I don't think they have anything that rises to top-tier, and, in any event, the best builds they do have are full of PvE skills. So dervish is out.

What's that leave? Ranger, monk, curse necro, possibly ele.

Alazardragoon · Jul 20, 2008, 03:57 AM // 03:57

Im going Ranger then lol

free_fall · Jul 20, 2008, 06:05 AM // 06:05

My 1st rit completed all 3 campaigns before acquiring Vampirism and was also the only prof I played that didn't use any elite skills (other than to try some out).

As the others have pointed out, no prof really needs the PvE skills to finish the campaigns.

Ranger is a good choice, have fun with it.

BFG · Jul 20, 2008, 02:47 PM // 14:47

PvE-only skills are a convenience more than an absolute necessity. There are still plenty of options for builds for all professions with which you can be successful.

N1ghtstalker · Jul 20, 2008, 02:52 PM // 14:52

there is no class that requires ss rep points
the ss skills are just a bonus but that's it

Steps_Descending · Jul 20, 2008, 03:21 PM // 15:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chthon

Mesmer is a pretty weak class for PvE, saddled with a lot of mechanics that are killer in PvP, but useless in PvE. In the midst of that suckiness, AP-AE-CoP shines like the fricking sun, but CoP needs sunspear rank. So mesmer is out.

Assassins pretty much require Critical Agility, so that's out.

What's that leave? Ranger, monk, curse necro, possibly ele.

I'd say something about Mesmer, tought I think the OP already made his choice. It is true mesmer have no "Top Tier build", if Alazar was going for a character easily accepted in High-end area it's out, but they work wonder in less heavily structured groups at taking the Big enemy in a group. The only PvE skill really useful is Pain Inverter, to kill AoE users, which can be echoed efficiently at lv1. Beyond that, the bests skills avalable are PvPs (Backfire, empathy, echo... that's the core).

Also, about assassins, do they really need more than SS rank 3 to make Crit Agility useful? Otherwise only Brawling Headbutt is used as KD.

EDIT : some spelling mistakes

isamu kurosawa · Jul 20, 2008, 03:27 PM // 15:27

No profession needs pve skills to be effective, they just help.

Sunspear skills in general work well at rank 7 as well, which can be achieved by simply playing through nightfall.

**cosyfiep** · Jul 20, 2008, 05:13 PM // 17:13

before nightfall even came out I am sure there were plenty of good builds (that would be before pve skills existed* and sunspear points)......we played the game for what 2 years before it????? I am sure that some people made some good builds before factions as well.....

(*yes the pve skills in factions came out before nightfall....but there were builds for sins and rits before people got them as well).

Narcissia · Jul 20, 2008, 05:20 PM // 17:20

no class requires pve skills. play around with some builds, ull find something u like without them.
and i would say yes monk is good, i havent really used any pve skills on mine aside from seed of life and i only ever use that in deep

Horseman Of War · Jul 20, 2008, 05:35 PM // 17:35

Well....

PvE paragons without "nothing to fear" should not go out in public. Not that they are uneffective without it... Im sure you understand what I mean.

Monks' Seed of Life is another big one... while it doesnt necessarily take MAX to have the skill work, the higher number does help.

(the assassin skill)- I havent taken my sin thru nightfall... but from what I understand, this skill is godly.

Forgive my failing memory, its early here.

Rhamia Darigaz · Jul 20, 2008, 05:35 PM // 17:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alazardragoon

I need to find a class that does not require 2 things. sunspear rep for some skills to work very good, Such as vampirism for spirit spammer Rit is a must have. And A class that don't require pvp rep based skills ether. Builds that are generally fun to play and use. That only require basic skills you can learn off tomes. Basically leaving all the rep skills out and still having a very good and effective build. I don't really have time to farm my way to max Kruzick rank. And what I have noticed is a lot of skills for Ritualists and a lot of its builds that involve spirits are focused around 2 Skills that Have a lot to do with rank and rep. Vampirism and Summon spirits. So Here's basically my question-

What class Can be leveled (Factions would be best) to level 20 And id be able to get skills and elite skills from totems mostly. Or the skill trainers. Where i would be able to get into eye of the north and be at full effectiveness with a build with those skills?

Bottom line I don't wanna spend hours and hours grinding reputation.

Is monk any good at this Just wondering cuz i do like healing in pvp.

you seem to think rits need vampirism and summon spirits to be good. try rits that don't spam spirits, they're better.
none of the classes need any pve skills to be effective.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps_Descending

It is true mesmer have no "Top Tier build", if Alazar was going for a character easily accepted in High-end area it's out, but they work wonder in less heavily structured groups at taking the Big enemy in a group. The only PvE skill really useful is Pain Inverter, to kill AoE users, which can be echoed efficiently at lv1. Beyond that, the bests skills avalable are PvPs (Backfire, empathy, echo... that's the core).

[skill]Pain inverter[/skill] is not a mesmer skill. backfire, empathy, and echo are hardly the best mesmer skills and good mesmers don't consider them "the core"